The Torch: AfPak: Video of interviews with with Pakistani president Zardari and Afghan president Karzai/Pak Talibs

From NBC's Meet the Press, May 10--latter at "Length 31:41" (also at end of earlier post, "Losing the infowar in Afstan"):

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Transcript here.

Whilst in Pakistan:

Fear and Worry Pervade Refugee Camps As Pakistanis Flee Assault on Taliban

MARDAN, Pakistan, May 10 -- As they waited in rows of empty white tents, refugees from fighting in the Swat Valley said Sunday that they had been repeating a Koranic verse from the sayings of the prophet Muhammad.

"He who recites this will receive my blessing and protection," one woman read from a pamphlet in Arabic. "If he is hungry, he will find plentiful food. . . . If he has fear of a cruel ruler or enemy . . . the fear will be gone."

The army has launched an offensive in Swat against armed Taliban extremists, and for now at least, there is enough food, water and shelter for the estimated 200,000 refugees who since Thursday have poured into four camps set up by the United Nations and the government of this northwest Pakistani city.

But there is a pervasive sense of loss and worry among the families that keep arriving in overcrowded farm trucks and rented vans. In interviews in two camps Saturday and Sunday, some refugees said their homes had been destroyed in the fighting. Others said they had to abandon their goats and cows. And some, in their rush to escape, even had to leave their children behind...

The army lifted a military curfew in Swat on Sunday, allowing thousands more people to stream out of the area after being stranded for several days, sometimes in areas of heavy shelling and gunfire. Many people walked or rode on donkey carts to the main road, then hitched rides toward Mardan or were picked up by relatives who had waited with vehicles at military checkpoints Saturday, hoping to reenter the conflict zone and retrieve them.

The army said Sunday that 180 suspected insurgents had been killed in the past 24 hours. Officials also said about 140 bodies of suspected insurgents had been discovered in Shangla district, next to Swat. As it lifted the curfew, the army encouraged as many people to leave the region as possible, suggesting that it may be preparing to further escalate its assault.

In the relative safety of the camps, where officials said they expect an additional 600,000 people to arrive in the coming days, the fear has receded a bit. But people still burst into tears or stammered when they related what they witnessed and endured during nearly two years of intermittent Taliban occupation, before the army launched its offensive across Swat last week...

...Some people said the patrolling insurgents behaved like moral vigilantes, asking men to go to mosques instead of chatting in tea shops, or telling them to write down names of thieves or land-grabbers and promising they would be punished.

Other refugees described techniques used by the militants to recruit boys and young men from their villages, sometimes by letting them hang around the fighters and handle their guns, sometimes by inviting them to join religious study classes and then not allowing them to leave [emphasis added]...

Over the past week, the refugees said, their lives had become a chaotic nightmare. Several described Taliban fighters firing at army helicopters from rooftops and then vanishing, leaving residents at the mercy of airborne army assaults. Many families said they had been trapped inside their homes during the crossfire between the army and the well-armed insurgents.

"The Taliban dug trenches and started shooting one soldier after another. Then the Cobra helicopters came and starting bombing, so we fled," said Sabzali Khan, 55, a dignified village elder who walked for miles to reach the highway to Mardan, leading his family and a goat who had just given birth to two kids. In Khan's tent Sunday, the baby goats suckled while a boy went to find grass for the mother.

"The government is partly to blame, but the Taliban are worse. They are a threat to the West and a threat to the Muslim world," said Khan, who is illiterate but said he follows the news closely. "I want to thank America, and France, and Canada, and all the countries who want to help us. We want to be brothers with all humanity, and the Taliban do not speak for us [emphasis added]."

Plus:

Morning Brief: Pakistan's expanding chaos
TOP STORY: Pakistan claims to be making progress in its offensive against the Taliban in the Swat Valley, but reliable information is hard to come by. Pakistan's interior minister says that 700 rebels were killed by raids in Swat over the last four days, though the military puts the number at only around 140. A suicide bomber killed 10 soldiers at a checkpoint earlier today.
What is certain is that Pakistan is facing a full-blown refugee crisis as a result of the fighting. Some 360,000 people from the disputed areas of Swat, Buner and Dir have registered at refugee camps since May 2, according to the U.N.
While most analysts say an Islamist takeover of the Pakistani state remains unlikely, the New York Times reports that al Qaeda is likely seizing on the chaos to create "mini-Afghanistans" throughout Pakistan, from which it can launch attacks with impunity.

The MND chimes in: